Get Out Of My Country - Page 3

Kona Palangi · 04-05-2007, 01:50 PM

The Mexican Government has their border militarized ... Why not ours?

remixFA · 04-05-2007, 02:28 PM

yea, its much harder for an american to jump into mexico illegally than it is for a mexican to jump back and forth.. silly isnt it? they can come n go as they please, but damn if they wont throw us in a mexican jail and forget about us.

los934 · 04-05-2007, 04:12 PM

remix why don't you work for 3 dollars an hour and then complain.
This country would crumble without cheap labor.
kicking all 12 million illegal immigrants out would devastate the economy.
First of all you do not know anything about the conditions in other countries, and second of all believe it or not illegal immigrants help out the economy more than they hurt it.
The lovely politicians in office get favors by large corporations like Tyson to keep illegals illegal so that Tyson can pay them jack and maximize profit.
It is completely retarded for immigrants marching to start causing violence. But remember that not all immigrants are like that, and the media is extremely bias.
Look into the bill they are trying to pass in congress. they have a guest worker program and a expensive fine for the ones that want to become legal. I'm not positive but I think it's about $3,000 per illegal... and like 1500 every 3 years after that. Imagine the possibilities.

remixFA · 04-05-2007, 04:22 PM

why dont i work for 3 bux an hr? BECAUSE IM AN AMERICAN CITIZEN... i know my worth and its not worth my time. what a stupid arguement. This country survived for years without the "cheap labor". Nothing would crumble.. So things would get a few bux more expencive.. guess what, you would save 10x that in the costs of ur insurance and taxes which get bumped up to take care of all these freaking illegals.
Do you know first hand of the conditions in other countrys? Hell, IVE BEEN TO MEXICO, ive walked through their slums.. IVE SEEN IT FIRST HAND. Howabout you???
Its not a guest worker program as much as it is an "amnesty" program. Basically any illegals that have been in the US more than X amount of years get a free citizenship. Its the same thing Regan did.. and it didnt work back then. It wont work now. All it will do is cause more illegals to jump the border and hope some stupid politician does it AGAIN.
Its quite pompous of you to attack my knowledge of a situation when you dont even know what it is. Your arguement is a sad regurgitation of what was already said... and discredited already.
My first question to any tard who wants to tell me i dont know about it first hand is.. where do you live? I deal with illegals all day every day. Ive been to mexico and seen things first hand. I am very aware of what our spineless anti-american scumbag senators and congressmen are up to. Give me a valid arguement, or just sit silently like the majority of people.

Lets some it up for you ... again.
illegals dont pay taxes
we pay taxes to support hospitals, schools, ect.
illegals have anchor baby's which get these services for free.
illegals now have the right in some places to get these services for free
this drives up OUR taxes, because again, someone has to pay for it, and they are not.
10 million illegal immigrants can now get liscences..
they drive cars with no insurance.
insurance costs go up.. someone has to pay for it, and its not them.
they stuff as many people as they can into a property, letting it go to ****..
this drives down property value.. bad for everyone but them.
they commit high amounts of violent crime.
they sell and do drugs
they create gangs
they refuse to learn the language, english... why should they, theres always a libby around to make sure things get printed in spanish
they bring their mexican ghettos with them to america.

oh wait.. they pick cheap fruit n veggies... i guess its a great tradeoff.

purp · 04-05-2007, 05:11 PM

they brought us tacos and burritos.
the macarena
cheap pot
taquila

but still, anyone crossing o0ur border illegally should have a .50 cal placed in their forehead.

come legally, one and all. try to sneak in and beware of flying lead.

If i lived in a southern border state, you can bet i would spend my free time armed and guarding the border.

los934 · 04-05-2007, 08:15 PM

You have no idea what you are talking about...
There is no such thing as an Amnesty program.
There is no way for illegals to get drivers license.
You obviously have not seen first hand what a truly F()cked up country is and have no knowledge of their immigration laws. If you "walked" through real slums you wouldn't be here today.
There are over 6 million illegal immigrants that pay taxes and will never see a penny of it.
The reason the housing market has been down is because of the illegal situation.
MOST illegals come here and buy houses and that helps the market.
The only reason they smuggle drugs is because AMERICANS use them.
The rate of illegals that commit crimes is nothing compared to the rate of crimes "citizens" do.

Really please try to get your facts straight. Go ahead try to discredit my facts.

I'm not saying it is right for illegals to come in. but there is no other way that the golden brick road is accessible to the true hard workers, the ones who want to improve themselves.

Secure border patrol.
give a process for citizenship... No criminal record and a fine.
However times you say that it is ok if prices go up a few bucks I can find 200 million people to disagree with you. Don't be a fool. You and I both want cheap goods. Why do you think walmart does so good?

AMERICA NEEDS THE HARDWORKING IMMIGRANTS.

salgado · 04-05-2007, 09:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by los934

You have no idea what you are talking about...
There is no such thing as an Amnesty program.
There is no way for illegals to get drivers license.
You obviously have not seen first hand what a truly F()cked up country is and have no knowledge of their immigration laws. If you "walked" through real slums you wouldn't be here today.
There are over 6 million illegal immigrants that pay taxes and will never see a penny of it.
The reason the housing market has been down is because of the illegal situation.
MOST illegals come here and buy houses and that helps the market.
The only reason they smuggle drugs is because AMERICANS use them.
The rate of illegals that commit crimes is nothing compared to the rate of crimes "citizens" do.

Really please try to get your facts straight. Go ahead try to discredit my facts.

I'm not saying it is right for illegals to come in. but there is no other way that the golden brick road is accessible to the true hard workers, the ones who want to improve themselves.

Secure border patrol.
give a process for citizenship... No criminal record and a fine.
However times you say that it is ok if prices go up a few bucks I can find 200 million people to disagree with you. Don't be a fool. You and I both want cheap goods. Why do you think walmart does so good?

AMERICA NEEDS THE HARDWORKING IMMIGRANTS.

Grindstone · 04-05-2007, 10:32 PM

Alright Remix, calm down -- as goes for the rest of you.

Look, the point is that does the US need +12 million illegals, and the answer is no. Giving amnesty to the illegals will not improve the situation, as Remix pointed out, it was done in the late 1980s, and if we keep doing it, then we might as well not have borders or immigration laws at all.

Working in a law firm that specializes in work comp and personal injury, I can guarantee you that illegals can and do obtain drivers licenses legally and illegally. As a matter of fact, they may be using your information to do so, as nearly all of them are using "borrowed" social security numbers. Interestingly, the Law Clerk at my office was recently denied student loans because he had an outstanding loan balance. As it turns out, an illegal immigrant in Florida was using his SS# for loan applications. The Law Clerk is now not going to Boston College this fall. The IRS is trying to help him mitigate the problem.

There is no simple solution, and congress will not do anything drastic because it'll effect the Latino voting population (not illegals). You may say that these illegals will only be taking jobs that we Americans supposedly do not want, but after we educate their children in our schools, for free, do you think they'll want to work in the fields too? No, they'll be a minority status, which means college application spots will go to them first, as well as grant money, and then since they'll be bilingual, their job resume will take precedence over yours.

In short, we're already screwed, we just need enough time to elapse to prove it. Invading culture, FTW!

I feel as though I should state that I have been through Mexico, from California all the way down to Guatemala, short visit in Belize, and then back up through Mexico Texas. I lived in Central America for a few years, so I can say that I do know a lot about the people, economical situation, culture and so forth. Let's face it, these countries are fine places to visit, but no American in their right mind would want to be a permanent part of these places.

As such, I can understand why they come up here, but lets not diminish the fact that it is a crime to illegally enter this country, and as a criminal, you should not have any rights. We do not reward people for breaking the law. However, there is no way we can make +12 million people leave, logistically speaking. So this issue was over before it even became a major issue. It is already lost. And more will continue to pile in, and eventually, areas of the US will look like a 3rd world country, because these people failed to leave their culture at the border and become part of the melting pot. I am already seeing it in my large town of Salem, OR.

What stupefies me is that $8 billion dollars is sent back to Mexico every year from migrant workers, yet Mexico still isn't any better, nor is their economic system improving. You can say that these illegals help our local, national and perhaps international markets, but I am of the opinion that it probably does not equal out overall if billions of dollars is being funneled out of the US.

My next question is, do they really want to become US citizens, or are they only here to milk our system? Immigrants used to come to the US strictly to become US citizens, improve their life and legacy. The goal was to be apart of the US dream, but from my perspective, that doesn't seem to be the mindset of this newer generation. Their not even legal and they are marching in our streets, blocking traffic, and shouting about equality (albeit in Spanish...).

I'll end now, 90% of you won't read something exceptionally long, as my first post fell on deaf ears, save for you, Don. This post is not supposed to anger anyone of latin heritage, but to give you a perspective that you can relate too, just as if you were a Mexican complaining about the Guatemalans/Salvadorans in Chiapas, or a Costa Rican upset about the Nicos, etc.

Grindstone · 04-05-2007, 10:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by los934

You have no idea what you are talking about...
There is no such thing as an Amnesty program.
There is no way for illegals to get drivers license.
You obviously have not seen first hand what a truly F()cked up country is and have no knowledge of their immigration laws. If you "walked" through real slums you wouldn't be here today.
There are over 6 million illegal immigrants that pay taxes and will never see a penny of it.
The reason the housing market has been down is because of the illegal situation.
MOST illegals come here and buy houses and that helps the market.
The only reason they smuggle drugs is because AMERICANS use them.
The rate of illegals that commit crimes is nothing compared to the rate of crimes "citizens" do.

Really please try to get your facts straight. Go ahead try to discredit my facts.

I'm not saying it is right for illegals to come in. but there is no other way that the golden brick road is accessible to the true hard workers, the ones who want to improve themselves.

Secure border patrol.
give a process for citizenship... No criminal record and a fine.
However times you say that it is ok if prices go up a few bucks I can find 200 million people to disagree with you. Don't be a fool. You and I both want cheap goods. Why do you think walmart does so good?

AMERICA NEEDS THE HARDWORKING IMMIGRANTS.

Seems you have a lot of opinion, but not much fact.

The reason the housing market is down is because there was a building boom, which was attributed to cheaper construction labor since an illegal immigrant could work for half of what his US counterpart could, without silly benefits such as medic, dental and 401k packages. Now we have too many houses and not enough buyers.

I'd say about 6 million pay taxes too, which is about half of the illegals in the US at this point. If those 6 million are paying taxes, that means they had to use a SS# to do so, which means that one day you could get audited by the IRS because they find out you made $100K but didn't offset your tax bracket. It'll be a nice surprise for you -- and you better hope that's all they did with your SS#...

If one illegal commits a crime, we pay for his court costs, attorney costs, jail time and parole officer, among other expenses. When they commit murder (and they have), what's our government excuse for that? A homicide that could have been avoided if the border had been secure...

Here, I corrected this for you:
AMERICA NEEDS THE HARDWORKING [LEGAL] IMMIGRANTS -- just like the ones we had before this massive influx of illegals.

remixFA · 04-05-2007, 11:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by los934

You have no idea what you are talking about...
There is no such thing as an Amnesty program.
There is no way for illegals to get drivers license.
You obviously have not seen first hand what a truly F()cked up country is and have no knowledge of their immigration laws. If you "walked" through real slums you wouldn't be here today.
There are over 6 million illegal immigrants that pay taxes and will never see a penny of it.
The reason the housing market has been down is because of the illegal situation.
MOST illegals come here and buy houses and that helps the market.
The only reason they smuggle drugs is because AMERICANS use them.
The rate of illegals that commit crimes is nothing compared to the rate of crimes "citizens" do.

Really please try to get your facts straight. Go ahead try to discredit my facts.

I'm not saying it is right for illegals to come in. but there is no other way that the golden brick road is accessible to the true hard workers, the ones who want to improve themselves.

Secure border patrol.
give a process for citizenship... No criminal record and a fine.
However times you say that it is ok if prices go up a few bucks I can find 200 million people to disagree with you. Don't be a fool. You and I both want cheap goods. Why do you think walmart does so good?

AMERICA NEEDS THE HARDWORKING IMMIGRANTS.

you are a funny funny man... boy.. person.. whatever.
i dont have to try to discredit you, you have already been discredited before you even typed your responce.
Amnesty was given by Ronald Regan to all ILLEGAL immigrants in the 80's. All the poor saps here on temp visas and green cards got shafted for trying to go about it legally.
Bush talked about it maybe 5 or 6 months ago about trying to give amnesty to any illegals here over a certain amount of time. There is only a few ways to prove it. 1 way is the very SMALL MINORITY of illegals that pay taxes to prove how long they have been here, hoping for another amnisty try. the MAJORITY of ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS do not pay taxes. They get paid under the table. You may sit there on your horse and tell me that they get paid less than minimum wage. They do not pay taxes. If u get paid 5 bux an hr cash, or 6.50 an hr on a paycheck, it equals about the same after taxes. So in essence they arent getting paid THAT MUCH less than a legal citizen in most cases.

Drivers Liscences. Again maybe you should keep up. California is leading the way in making it possible for any illegal to get a drivers liscense. The insurance companies are helping push this through, so illegals will get car insurance.

My experience.. im glad you have followed my entire life to know what i have n havent done. Could you please provide pictures and video proving that you stalk me 24/7? If not, dont assume u know something I dont.

Have you ever bought a house? thats a stupid freaking statement you made. You need drivers liscenses, social security cards, W2's, credit checks, ect ect ect to buy a house.. LITTLE TO NO ILLEGALS buy a house.. its near impossible. where do you come up with this stupidity? They rent houses, and they pack like 15 - 40 peeps in them. I lived in an appt next to illegals that had maybe 10-14 peeps living in there. Where do you live? I live in FL, one of the worst states when it comes to illegal border jumping. They are everywhere here.

They smuggle drugs into america because the druglord SECURES their passage to america. They dont give a flying crap about what happends to the drugs.

The rate of crime commited by illegals and their family's is high comparitivly to MOST races in america. While many illegals come here and work their butts off, their anchor babies have it easy as stated above, and turn to crime in many cases. There has been report after report of this. Wake up and listen to something besides air america.
Their anchor babys have it incredibly easy. Since anchor babys are automatically US citizens, they get medicaid, medicare, free schooling, prefered scholarships for beign a minority, vouchers for private schools in some cases... all while their parents DONT PAY ANY TAXES because they are still illegal immigrants... who pays for that? AMERICAN CITIZENS.

I love how you said the housing market is down because of illegal immigrants. Could you PLEEEAAAASEE explain that bit of retardation to me? The housing market is down because the artificially inflated $$$ bubble is deflating. Of course, its not bad everywhere, where i live its still on the up n up. Its deflating because the INFLATION was caused by the increase in subprime lending to people who didnt qualify for housing otherwise.. high demand drives higher prices. Now all those people who couldnt really afford the house are going bankrupt and we are seeing the largest forclosure ratings in history. This is causing housing prices to stablize or drop because of DECREASED demand and a bunch of houses sitting on the market for long periods of time.

please.. if your going to argue with me, atleast attach some kind of convoluted reasoning to your shallow and insubstantial dribble.

Ahh, they yellow brick road.. its called LEGAL IMMIGRATION... u know.. student visas, green cards, temporary worker programs, natrualization, permanent alien resident, ect ect. So.. hows the yellow brick road blocked off?

go ahead.. try to discredit your statements..
ok.. done. ... did i miss anything?? haha.

btw, if u want to argue politics, u need to make sure u know who ur opponent is. i dont know who you are, but im one of the most political savy people on this site.. ask around.. like it or not, i know my shiznit.

Kona Palangi · 04-05-2007, 11:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grindstone

Seems you have a lot of opinion, but not much fact.

The reason the housing market is down is because there was a building boom, which was attributed to cheaper construction labor since an illegal immigrant could work for half of what his US counterpart could, without silly benefits such as medic, dental and 401k packages. Now we have too many houses and not enough buyers.

I'd say about 6 million pay taxes too, which is about half of the illegals in the US at this point. If those 6 million are paying taxes, that means they had to use a SS# to do so, which means that one day you could get audited by the IRS because they find out you made $100K but didn't offset your tax bracket. It'll be a nice surprise for you -- and you better hope that's all they did with your SS#...

If one illegal commits a crime, we pay for his court costs, attorney costs, jail time and parole officer, among other expenses. When they commit murder (and they have), what's our government excuse for that? A homicide that could have been avoided if the border had been secure...

Here, I corrected this for you:
AMERICA NEEDS THE HARDWORKING [LEGAL] IMMIGRANTS -- just like the ones we had before this massive influx of illegals.

YOU JUST GOT HANDLED

Grindstone!!!!!

los934 · 05-05-2007, 01:17 AM

First of all Bush doesn't want to give any kind of amnesty whatsoever. He is completely against it.

Illegal taxpayers have fake SS #'s therefore what they pay in taxes is for no reason. (True it does not cover the costs of other illegals).

About the housing Market you are completely right... but you yourself stated that they have access to drivers licenses and ss #'s. they use those to buy houses. With new fears of deportation activity, Illegals are reluctant to invest. You would be surprise on the number of illegals that purchase homes.
The number of foreclosures is incredible but right now is the perfect time to buy houses. Believe it or not Immigrants have purchasing power.

If you want you could compare the $6.50 legal way or the $3 illegal pay. but think of the work done ...

At no point in time have I mentioned that it is ok for illegals to come to the US.

Again, I agree on border patrol.
A path to citizenship for illegals with a fine. and the latest bill in congress right now has a hell of a fine attached to it.
kick people with criminal records out.
and make it easier for hardworking immigrants (educated) to come work here. There is a plethora of talent in South American countries that because of those countries economic issues they end up driving taxis.

The Immigration system is faulty. Here and in other countries. Believe me when I say that it is somehow easier for a farmer with chickens to come to the US than say an architect.

What I am trying to get out of this is that immigration is good. And personally I think that it might be what this country economy needs.

...I know it's coming so let's hear it.

Kona Palangi · 05-05-2007, 12:03 PM

I'm gonna wait for a Remix reply then we'll see.

los934 · 05-05-2007, 02:11 PM

Bush proposed bill for illegal immigrants
Sun.Star Cebu - Reeves: Comprehensive immigration reform

Housing Market
Mortgages for Illegal Immigrants Becoming More Common : RISMedia

This is what you said Remix: "Bush talked about it maybe 5 or 6 months ago about trying to give amnesty to any illegals here over a certain amount of time."
This is Bush at the state of the union address in 2006:
Keeping America competitive requires an immigration system that upholds our laws, reflects our values, and serves the interests of our economy. Our nation needs orderly and secure borders. (Applause.) To meet this goal, we must have stronger immigration enforcement and border protection. (Applause.) And we must have a rational, humane guest worker program that rejects amnesty, allows temporary jobs for people who seek them legally, and reduces smuggling and crime at the border. (Applause.)

* * * * State of the Union 2006 * * * *

remixFA · 05-05-2007, 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by los934

First of all Bush doesn't want to give any kind of amnesty whatsoever. He is completely against it.

Illegal taxpayers have fake SS #'s therefore what they pay in taxes is for no reason. (True it does not cover the costs of other illegals).

About the housing Market you are completely right... but you yourself stated that they have access to drivers licenses and ss #'s. they use those to buy houses. With new fears of deportation activity, Illegals are reluctant to invest. You would be surprise on the number of illegals that purchase homes.
The number of foreclosures is incredible but right now is the perfect time to buy houses. Believe it or not Immigrants have purchasing power.

If you want you could compare the $6.50 legal way or the $3 illegal pay. but think of the work done ...

At no point in time have I mentioned that it is ok for illegals to come to the US.

Again, I agree on border patrol.
A path to citizenship for illegals with a fine. and the latest bill in congress right now has a hell of a fine attached to it.
kick people with criminal records out.
and make it easier for hardworking immigrants (educated) to come work here. There is a plethora of talent in South American countries that because of those countries economic issues they end up driving taxis.

The Immigration system is faulty. Here and in other countries. Believe me when I say that it is somehow easier for a farmer with chickens to come to the US than say an architect.

What I am trying to get out of this is that immigration is good. And personally I think that it might be what this country economy needs.

...I know it's coming so let's hear it.

aww thanx malo.
dude, ur on a boat.. its called the TITANIC, and ur arguement is sinking fast with it. Please again, do some research before you argue a point with no validity.
Bush IS for amnesty. Hes tried to push the bill a few times, but the REAL republicans and (the very few) not-braindead libbys keep it from happening. Keep up. Bush and our libby congress have now made it possible for MEXICAN trucking companies to come and go through the border as THEY PLEASE with no hassle. You might as well just invite more border jumpers to hop in the back of those trucks... which dont even have to abide by US LAW! They are not gonna be held up to the same DOT standards as American drivers. How ludacris is that. Who here is gonna bet on how long it takes for one of these morons to cause a fatal accident??? Who pays for that? WE DO as our insurance will spike further to cover these added dangers on the road.

Show me some facts on this "illegals buy lots of houses" retardation you keep spouting... or just give it up.
I just bought a house, i named only the tip of the iceberg of crap that you have to go through to get a house in my last responce. The percentage of illegals who will manage to get through that web is very small. Have you ever bought a house? If you have, you might understand more.

As grindy has already pointed out about the social security cards, they are fakes.. because they are fake does not mean its a random number the government hasnt used, it means its just a random number that probably ALREADY belongs to someone. When you go buy a house, they do a background and a credit check, if everything doesnt match 100%, u are not getting a house. So when the credit check from the SS# comes up saying "Sally Mae" and your liscense says "Jose Canseco", there will be a problem.
EDUCATION IS KEY TO A FULL LIFE!!

id stil love to know where u get this "bush is against amnesty" BS. Even as governor of Texas he loosend the border security in his state. There are numerous complaints by constituents about his lax approach to border control. Then again when the lobbyist pays you a half mill in cash to not pay attention to the borders, ur sure to find something else to do.

You know why its so much harder for EDUCATED immigrants to come here? Because they have a little pride and intelligence and want to come here Legally. BTW, its really not that hard to get a student visa or a temp alien residency visa... of course, it does take longer than say... jumping the Rio Grande.
That sad little "fine" you talk about also nets them a green card when they pay it. So its more like a bribe to become a legal resident.

Do me.. well.. you a favor. Before you come back with another empty arguement with no base.. go Google ur subjects and come back with some links to prove your arguement. I just wanna see if you can.